oldskeezy:blah...And this was my point and lies in direct contradiction to RDM's simplistic assertion that all people have to do is simply start spending again and we'll be all fine and dandy. In order for the system to function long term, people--especially in the US need to consume FAR FAR less and save more. Otherwise we'll continute to run huge current accoutn deficts and our currency will continue its downward slide into $hitdom.
On the other hand, us consumerist Canadians can take advantage of the sh1t state of the U.S. dollar right now and buy lots of snowboarding crap cheaper in the US this winter.
im.inc.:You’re problem is that you are not seeing anything in the long run. You are only seeing what is in directly in front of you. If you have multiple companies that are providing the same goods and services going out of businesses because of drops in sales. Then yes there will be inflation over time. That’s why I said it’s the “start of inflation.” Your competition helps set the market standard for price. If there is little to no competition then who sets the price? Take Utah for example. If Alta, Solitude, and the Canyons closed their doors do you think that Brighton, Snowbird, or park city would drop their prices, or even keep them the same? No they would have to raise the prices because of the increased demand and if everything was cheep the mountain would get too crowded and people would stop coming. Just because a store closes or company goes under doesn’t mean that those sales (however small) just vanish and there is no longer a need. They just move on to somebody else. If Chevy went out of business would people stop buying cars? No they would just pick a different brand. So if people don’t see things your way then things are fruitless. Awesome.
Look up the definition of inflation--its an increase in the money supply which MAY manifest itself in higher prices. Higher prices are not the technical meaning of inflation.Why may? Well look now at what's happening--the Fed is printing trillions (a huge increase in the money supply), yet a huge output gap exists between the actual productive capacity of the economy and what people are doing with the excess cash liquidity thats currently floating around--they're mostly saving now or starting that saving/deleveraging process. As soon as people start really spending that scrilla on tons of stuff, then the output gap will close and higher interest rates will follow along with higher prices to follow.
Your idea about Chevy doesnt make sense either--perhaps Chevy goes out of business because of les demand--why else would they go out of business--especialy with the govt backstopping them to some extent. There are a LOT less cars being purchased, so it follows that a LOT less need to be made. Its called creative destruction-from Joseph Schumpter--look it up. People dont necessarily need to keep unproductive industries open--they can be allowed to fail and that may be a good thing.
Your little example of the ski resorts doesnt work because of two reasons. One can only assume that if a ski resort(s) closes that its due to decreased demand and therefore less operating revenues. There may be other factors, but lets assume for the sake of argument--its less demand. Well if the market is shrinking due to less demand, then the remaining resorts would no be able to raise prices since they are fighting for a decreased amount of customers. Also, you assume that if one company were to fold, say for, lack of funding, that another company couldnt step in and repurchase the lifts and run it bare bones with a different business model--one that generated profits despite less people---cut the fat so to speak. Do resorts really need tons of fancy $hit that costs a lot of extra scrill?
True dat. Canada is only of the only 1st world economic OECD countries that has its $hit together--hence the huge rise in your "loony."
It appears that you guys actually had decent capital controls and didnt allow your banks go hog wild on the leveraging---thus you've escaped having to bail everyone out.
oldskeezy:Hey you can use copy and paste--that's great. Good for you. I've learned my lesson here--discussing economics on this board is a complete waste of time as many people have yet to even take a class on it or know what the hell I am talking about. I'll make sure I keep my posts on point from now on and discuss how that new board is gonna make me a better shredder, or how mismatched bindings are cool as hell, or what color my bandana/beanie combo is and if I should opt for the XXL tall tee or go real white boy gansta and get XXXL tall tee. HAHHAHAHHA moneygripp: oldskeezy: No dumba$$ he's wrong, like you're wrong--as yes I have read and read Roubini, Ferguson, Tabbibi, etc etc almost daily. Go do yourself a favor and read some Schiff. I think you're the one who isnt reading them--or perhaps you are reading them and you simply dont get it. Again, go re-read my post--I was talking about the average person--I didnt say anything about the banks did I? No. There's a large percentage of this country (and around the world--Europe--West and East) that are in severe debt. What the economy needs in the long run is to not reinflate the Greenspan/Bernake bubble by offering $8K payoffs to take on overpriced homes and $4500 cash for junkers deal to put people further in debt, its to ELIMINATE that debt--so the economy can function properly. Economists call this a "debt jubillee" whereby debt is erased --ie by rewriting mortgages, renegotiating credit card loan balances, nationalizing banks that are insolvent, etc ect. Or absent this, people need to take the time to deleverage (ie--pay down debt)--pay off loans, credit cards, etc. Businesses as well need to do these things. Until these things are done the long term viability of the US economy will be in real danger of turning into what Japan has seen for the last 20 years--what is called a deflationary debt spiral. People had some much debt that they couldnt afford to live except by means of credit--so they needed to pay this credit off. before things could get better. Problem is only in the last few years have they really, slowly started to improve. Yes, banks are filled with liquid cash-by giving them 0% loans (at Taxpayer expense)--where they flip that money in microsecond trades but dont loan anything out--thats a short term fix. People need to get out of debt, even if that means the economy suffers--because if they dont get out of debt--they wont be able to service their debt when interest rates go through the roof when the rest of the world stops buying our t-bills at auction and they wont be able to afford $hit let along di*k. There's no such thing as spending your way out of the recession when your credit card balances are maxed out because citibank cut your credit line or increased your max payment, there's no spending your way out of a recession when your home which you've previously used as an ATM is $100,000 underwater and the credit line has dried up, there's no spending your way out of the recession when you've lost your job or your hours have been cut, theres no spending your way out of a recession when your 401K just took a massive $hit, there's no spending your way out of the recession when the bank wont give you a loan for anything, and there's certainly no way you're gonna by a $hitty Yes board cause some derelict who can huck a 720 told you so. SO yeah, start RE-reading your financial blogs guy. As I wave my hand --Abracadabra! Bam! You're still ignorant! Nice try though. I was just hoping you could give me some insight into the evolution of the market economy in the early colonies. My contention is that prior to the Revolutionary War the economic modalities especially of the southern colonies could most aptly be characterized as agrarian precapitalist convinced that Virginia and Pennsylvania were strongly entrepreneurial capitalist back in 1740. Gordon Wood said about the pre-revolutionary utopia and the capital-forming effects of military mobilization. Wood drastically underestimates the impact of social distinctions predicated upon wealth, especially inherited wealth.
Hey you can use copy and paste--that's great. Good for you.
I've learned my lesson here--discussing economics on this board is a complete waste of time as many people have yet to even take a class on it or know what the hell I am talking about.
I'll make sure I keep my posts on point from now on and discuss how that new board is gonna make me a better shredder, or how mismatched bindings are cool as hell, or what color my bandana/beanie combo is and if I should opt for the XXL tall tee or go real white boy gansta and get XXXL tall tee.
HAHHAHAHHA
moneygripp: oldskeezy: No dumba$$ he's wrong, like you're wrong--as yes I have read and read Roubini, Ferguson, Tabbibi, etc etc almost daily. Go do yourself a favor and read some Schiff. I think you're the one who isnt reading them--or perhaps you are reading them and you simply dont get it. Again, go re-read my post--I was talking about the average person--I didnt say anything about the banks did I? No. There's a large percentage of this country (and around the world--Europe--West and East) that are in severe debt. What the economy needs in the long run is to not reinflate the Greenspan/Bernake bubble by offering $8K payoffs to take on overpriced homes and $4500 cash for junkers deal to put people further in debt, its to ELIMINATE that debt--so the economy can function properly. Economists call this a "debt jubillee" whereby debt is erased --ie by rewriting mortgages, renegotiating credit card loan balances, nationalizing banks that are insolvent, etc ect. Or absent this, people need to take the time to deleverage (ie--pay down debt)--pay off loans, credit cards, etc. Businesses as well need to do these things. Until these things are done the long term viability of the US economy will be in real danger of turning into what Japan has seen for the last 20 years--what is called a deflationary debt spiral. People had some much debt that they couldnt afford to live except by means of credit--so they needed to pay this credit off. before things could get better. Problem is only in the last few years have they really, slowly started to improve. Yes, banks are filled with liquid cash-by giving them 0% loans (at Taxpayer expense)--where they flip that money in microsecond trades but dont loan anything out--thats a short term fix. People need to get out of debt, even if that means the economy suffers--because if they dont get out of debt--they wont be able to service their debt when interest rates go through the roof when the rest of the world stops buying our t-bills at auction and they wont be able to afford $hit let along di*k. There's no such thing as spending your way out of the recession when your credit card balances are maxed out because citibank cut your credit line or increased your max payment, there's no spending your way out of a recession when your home which you've previously used as an ATM is $100,000 underwater and the credit line has dried up, there's no spending your way out of the recession when you've lost your job or your hours have been cut, theres no spending your way out of a recession when your 401K just took a massive $hit, there's no spending your way out of the recession when the bank wont give you a loan for anything, and there's certainly no way you're gonna by a $hitty Yes board cause some derelict who can huck a 720 told you so. SO yeah, start RE-reading your financial blogs guy. As I wave my hand --Abracadabra! Bam! You're still ignorant! Nice try though. I was just hoping you could give me some insight into the evolution of the market economy in the early colonies. My contention is that prior to the Revolutionary War the economic modalities especially of the southern colonies could most aptly be characterized as agrarian precapitalist convinced that Virginia and Pennsylvania were strongly entrepreneurial capitalist back in 1740. Gordon Wood said about the pre-revolutionary utopia and the capital-forming effects of military mobilization. Wood drastically underestimates the impact of social distinctions predicated upon wealth, especially inherited wealth.
oldskeezy: No dumba$$ he's wrong, like you're wrong--as yes I have read and read Roubini, Ferguson, Tabbibi, etc etc almost daily. Go do yourself a favor and read some Schiff. I think you're the one who isnt reading them--or perhaps you are reading them and you simply dont get it. Again, go re-read my post--I was talking about the average person--I didnt say anything about the banks did I? No. There's a large percentage of this country (and around the world--Europe--West and East) that are in severe debt. What the economy needs in the long run is to not reinflate the Greenspan/Bernake bubble by offering $8K payoffs to take on overpriced homes and $4500 cash for junkers deal to put people further in debt, its to ELIMINATE that debt--so the economy can function properly. Economists call this a "debt jubillee" whereby debt is erased --ie by rewriting mortgages, renegotiating credit card loan balances, nationalizing banks that are insolvent, etc ect. Or absent this, people need to take the time to deleverage (ie--pay down debt)--pay off loans, credit cards, etc. Businesses as well need to do these things. Until these things are done the long term viability of the US economy will be in real danger of turning into what Japan has seen for the last 20 years--what is called a deflationary debt spiral. People had some much debt that they couldnt afford to live except by means of credit--so they needed to pay this credit off. before things could get better. Problem is only in the last few years have they really, slowly started to improve. Yes, banks are filled with liquid cash-by giving them 0% loans (at Taxpayer expense)--where they flip that money in microsecond trades but dont loan anything out--thats a short term fix. People need to get out of debt, even if that means the economy suffers--because if they dont get out of debt--they wont be able to service their debt when interest rates go through the roof when the rest of the world stops buying our t-bills at auction and they wont be able to afford $hit let along di*k. There's no such thing as spending your way out of the recession when your credit card balances are maxed out because citibank cut your credit line or increased your max payment, there's no spending your way out of a recession when your home which you've previously used as an ATM is $100,000 underwater and the credit line has dried up, there's no spending your way out of the recession when you've lost your job or your hours have been cut, theres no spending your way out of a recession when your 401K just took a massive $hit, there's no spending your way out of the recession when the bank wont give you a loan for anything, and there's certainly no way you're gonna by a $hitty Yes board cause some derelict who can huck a 720 told you so. SO yeah, start RE-reading your financial blogs guy. As I wave my hand --Abracadabra! Bam! You're still ignorant! Nice try though.
No dumba$$ he's wrong, like you're wrong--as yes I have read and read Roubini, Ferguson, Tabbibi, etc etc almost daily. Go do yourself a favor and read some Schiff. I think you're the one who isnt reading them--or perhaps you are reading them and you simply dont get it. Again, go re-read my post--I was talking about the average person--I didnt say anything about the banks did I? No. There's a large percentage of this country (and around the world--Europe--West and East) that are in severe debt. What the economy needs in the long run is to not reinflate the Greenspan/Bernake bubble by offering $8K payoffs to take on overpriced homes and $4500 cash for junkers deal to put people further in debt, its to ELIMINATE that debt--so the economy can function properly. Economists call this a "debt jubillee" whereby debt is erased --ie by rewriting mortgages, renegotiating credit card loan balances, nationalizing banks that are insolvent, etc ect. Or absent this, people need to take the time to deleverage (ie--pay down debt)--pay off loans, credit cards, etc. Businesses as well need to do these things. Until these things are done the long term viability of the US economy will be in real danger of turning into what Japan has seen for the last 20 years--what is called a deflationary debt spiral. People had some much debt that they couldnt afford to live except by means of credit--so they needed to pay this credit off. before things could get better. Problem is only in the last few years have they really, slowly started to improve. Yes, banks are filled with liquid cash-by giving them 0% loans (at Taxpayer expense)--where they flip that money in microsecond trades but dont loan anything out--thats a short term fix. People need to get out of debt, even if that means the economy suffers--because if they dont get out of debt--they wont be able to service their debt when interest rates go through the roof when the rest of the world stops buying our t-bills at auction and they wont be able to afford $hit let along di*k. There's no such thing as spending your way out of the recession when your credit card balances are maxed out because citibank cut your credit line or increased your max payment, there's no spending your way out of a recession when your home which you've previously used as an ATM is $100,000 underwater and the credit line has dried up, there's no spending your way out of the recession when you've lost your job or your hours have been cut, theres no spending your way out of a recession when your 401K just took a massive $hit, there's no spending your way out of the recession when the bank wont give you a loan for anything, and there's certainly no way you're gonna by a $hitty Yes board cause some derelict who can huck a 720 told you so.
SO yeah, start RE-reading your financial blogs guy. As I wave my hand --Abracadabra! Bam! You're still ignorant! Nice try though.
moneygripp:...a SHITLOAD of people here are KILLERS in the finacial world and you have a Shitload of people that make six figures...do you think you make that much a year and don't know how to invest it properly and manage you debt?? ...
Don't kid yourself, There are plenty of people with six figure incomes who couldn't financially manage a popsicle stand. The bigger the boys the bigger the toys, and the debt.